Shurmurball is Back in Browns Preseason Opener

by Cleveland Frowns on August 13, 2012

Nine passing attempts isn’t a lot. It only seems that way when one is picked off, another bounces off the pads of an opposing cornerback who’s streaking for your end zone, and a tenth is ruled a fumble.

Eight penalties and allowing your opponent 6.4 yards per carry all in the first half, though? That’s just Shurmurball.

DRINK!

Like Brandon Weeden in 2012, Joe Flacco and Ben Roethlisberger were inserted as starters, presumed career starters, in their respective rookie seasons as well. What kind of quarterback would either one be today if he would have had to come up playing with a defense that couldn’t stop the run — with more pressure on every drive, the impact of every mistake compounded? It’s something to think about as the season progresses. And if you want more proof of the connection between run defense and the ability to develop a young quarterback, well, how could you possibly want more proof of that?

DRINK!

D’Qwell and Rubin weren’t out there on Friday, so maybe that 6.4 ypc gets shaved down by a couple so that we’re only giving up a first down on every third play instead of every two. Jordan Cameron and Travis Benjamin looked good as well. Tomorrow we’ll have an Xs and Os post from Rod to break down Benjamin’s long first quarter catch, so look forward to that (and here’s Rod’s writeup on Friday night’s game if you missed it).

—————

In other news, Mary Kay Sunshine writes about all the discoveries the Browns made on Friday night, including Weeden’s realization that turnovers are bad, and:

“The biggest thing Weeden learned during his debut is that a field goal can be a beautiful thing.”

What’s up is down, what’s left is right …

Browns head to Green Bay Thursday night for the next preseason tuneup. Hope everyone’s week gets off to a decent start.

Beeej

I only caught the last couple minutes of the game on the radio on Friday. Did anyone see some “things?”
- BIKI024
  
  even if they did show some “things”, who cares, it’s the preseason, the defenses don’t exactly gameplan so it puts them at a disadvantage. sure there are guys fighting for roster spots, etc, but otherwise a meaningless display with the only thing meaningful is if teams make it through without any major injuries. the Pats are notorious for flubbing in the preseason and look where that gets them.
  - ClevelandFrowns
    
    Of course, what unfolded on Friday was just part of Shurmur’s Belichickian plan.
    
    Or Brandon Weeden went for two turnovers and a 20 rating against a defense that “didn’t exactly gameplan.”
    
    Pass the bath salts, Superfan.
    - BIKI024
      
      lol, if Weeden went 10 for 10 with 3 TDs in first three possessions you would find a way to rip him to shreds as well. it’s the freaking preseason, it is what it is. DERP
    - BIKI024
      
      black and yellow, black and yellow, black and yellow!
    - BIKI024
      
      yo statboy, go check out your boy Andy Dalton’s stats from his first 5 drives in preseason last year. turrrrrrrible
      - ClevelandFrowns
        
        In his first 3 drives, he led his team to a score and completed 2/3rds of his passes, but whatever.
      - BIKI024
        
        LAST season? check again statboy
      - ClevelandFrowns
        
        Yes, LAST season, you dolt. He was 11-15 and led his team on one scoring drive out of three. His one interception was on a 40 yard bomb that wasn’t returned. http://espn.go.com/nfl/boxscore?gameId=310812008 The Jets made him look bad the next week, and he was solid for the last two preseason games, completing 2/3 of his passes the rest of the way out.
        
        Anyway, it’s understood that a rookie quarterback will have his ups and downs in his first preseason. The point here is just that the concerns folks had about Weeden from the beginning looked to be very real last Friday.
      - BIKI024
        
        Dalton was picked off on his first preseason NFL snap last year:
        
        http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2011081251/2011/PRE1/bengals@lions#menu=drivechart&tab=recap
      - BIKI024
        
        besides, as has been much discussed around here, Yards Per Attempt is more important than completion percentage. As rough as Weeden’s 3-9 looks on paper, he averaged 6.9 yards per attempt. whereas Dalton’s 11-15 was a pedestrian Colt McCoy like 4.6
      - ClevelandFrowns
        
        I’m pretty sure I’ve never talked about Yards per Attempt even once, but anyway, Weeden turned the ball over on 2/3rds of his drives, scored zero points, and had a rating of 20. Will you please give us a break now and go muck up the comments section somewhere else?
      - BIKI024
        
        and his 3 completions were reasons to be very optimistic, we haven’t had a QB who could make that throw to Benjamin in several years. these “concerns” people have after 9 attempts in the first preseason game with many blown assignments around him is as Cleveland as it gets.
      - ClevelandFrowns
        
        “We haven’t had a QB who could make that throw to Benjamin in several years.”
        
        Right, his name was Derek Anderson. Now go away, seriously. Last warning.
  - bupalos
    
    The Pats are generally in the mode of taking a look at potential role players while concentrating on not getting hurt, as they gradually ease in to another superbowl run and polish up their hall of fame credentials. The regime in with the Browns right now is in the mode of digging their bloody fingernails another millimeter into the bottom left corner of NFL survival. Curly needs to put the coffee down.
    - BIKI024
      
      it’s not just the Pats bud, there is no correlation that preseason failure or success has any bearing whatsoever on the regular season. but let the haters hate-on, it’s so fun! we’re not Detroit!
      - NeedsFoodBadly
        
        yeah, detroit went 10-6 and made the postseason last year. We’re definitely not detroit.
      - BIKI024
        
        we’re not Detroit!
      - Petefranklin
        
        And the Tigers make another playoff run with a true ace leading the way. Were not even close to Detroit.
      - bupalos
        
        It’s not a question of “correlation to the regular season.” It’s a question of “what do we have here?” With so many rookies (unfortunately I think Pat may perennially fall into this category) the preseason can show you a lot, especially the kinds of mistakes to which guys are prone.
        
        The biggest things I saw (though it’s partially confirmation bias) is that Weeden is going to have a hard time with after-the-snap read and react. And part of that is that he has a kind of wind-up that he does. I think in college he looked quick because that offense was just pre-snap read and boom, that’s where you’re going. He could get his body ready on the drop or as the snap is coming in. Get in his wind-up zone and he’s a disaster.
        
        And I think Pat is just basically a lazy person. He talks lazily, he coaches lazily, and his greatest supposed virtue (staying calm) is the flipside of a coaster.
      - BIKI024
        
        By all accounts Weeden has an extremely high football IQ and progressed game to game during his time at OSU. Hopefully this aptitude of his will apply to the NFL game as well and reduce the learning curve that every NFL rookie experiences. Besides, I’m not sure 9 pass attempts in his first dose of NFL action is nearly enough sample size, but everyone’s a QB expert these days from watching a few snaps, so why can’t you be one as well.
        
        re: Shurmur being lazy.. now how on earth would you know anything about that? i’ve read many knocks against Shurmur, but lazy hasn’t been one of them. not sure you make it in the NFL, let alone a HC, even if your agent is Bob LaMonte, by being lazy.
      - dubbythe1
        
        this response is meant for Biki’s retort to this comment, but it wont let me click reply on his so….
        
        Name one other team that Shurmur would be a HC candidate…based on his merits…
      - actovegin1armstrong
        
        Bupa,
        I am certainly not a definitive authority on the subject, but I posted a photo of a big ugly guy wearing Browns gear at the UT- Oklahoma State game last year and Weeden was looking at; at least three reads before he winged it.
        (I was sitting with our brilliant but uninformed mayor playing “color commentator” for our group.)
        I was not amazed by Rollie Blackman, but I did like Weeden. He only had about 200 throwing yards, but that was because his running game was rolling.
        I would put him far above that holographic chip guy.
      - dubbythe1
        
        what conclusions can be drawn from the preseason? Not just for the Browns, but for any team, including super teams, etc? Im not asking for specifics to each team, but general correlations as you have referenced.
      - BIKI024
        
        by all accounts that I’ve heard from several coaches, including the Hoodie is that not much can be concluded from Preseason, other than roster battles. i’m assuming many of the reasons coaches/players want to reduce preseason games is because they also feel that it is rather pointless for the most part.
      - BIKI024
        
        re: Shurmur’s merits. so you actually think Holmgren just wants to make his agent a few hundred grand, that was his only motivation in hiring Shurmur? there are 16 current and former head coaches in Holmgren’s coaching tree, i think he knows a thing or 2 about what traits a coach needs to be successful, obviously he feels Pat has what it takes to be a leader of men. we’ll see how it plays out for the Shurminator, obviously, I’m rooting for the guy.
      - bupalos
        
        >>>Besides, I’m not sure 9 pass attempts in his first dose of NFL action is nearly enough sample size>>
        
        Of course not, and I’m not saying he won’t develop. While I’d still trade him right now for DeCastro, I’m optimistic he’ll be at the least a decent upgrade and maybe an actual QB at some point. Mistakes and all, he still got as many yards as the other meatballs in the same number of passes against better defense. I’m just reacting to you acting like there is no significance whatsoever to Thursday’s action.
      - BIKI024
        
        there is zero significance to Thursday’s game, other than Weeden getting some much needed reps and to try to build some chemistry. obviously everyone was a bit shaky, particularly the rookies, which is to be expected and all played their part in Weeden’s sub-par performance, helped by another one of Little’s classic drops that resulted in a pick
    - actovegin1armstrong
      
      Sorry Bupa, I posted my unimportant drivel before I scrolled down and saw that you had already addressed the issue.
      “Put the Coffee Down.”
      I say this famous line at least twice week at work.
      Or when someone across our beautiful country jumps up to challenge me, I say “steak knives”.
      Love you and the Glen reference Bupa!
  - actovegin1armstrong
    
    I am with Superfan on this one. (Even though he rarely answers when I ask him stuff?)
    Some of the best Browns teams that I can recall looked horrible in pre-season games.
    Pre-season goals:
    1.) Evaluate players and position coaches
    2.) Do not tip your hand for more intricate O and D schemes.
    3.) Limit injuries as much as possible.
    4.) And most importantly, make a little money off of practice games.
    
    Frownie, we are in the “too early to tell phase”. (However I am trying to confirm an interesting rumor I received from a high placed “White Horse Soused”.
    (Am I the only kid around here old enough to remember Kermit Schafer?)
    - BIKI024
      
      ask away Acto!
    - dubbythe1
      
      we are failing hard on #3
    - Petefranklin
      
      I think the Browns need to tip their hand towards the long(er) passing game against pre season defenses. We do have a draft pick that does not need to be keyed on. Hopefully he wont get killed if the passing game has some competance, and it should be much easier to show competance vs. 2nd stringers, key word …should.
      - actovegin1armstrong
        
        Pete Frank, I thought that Montario Richardson was already out for the season.
Leftyjsf

What if? Weeden stinks it up? Can this regime last an 0-4 start?

…still clinging to Colt McCoy train
- bupalos
  
  >>>…still clinging to Colt McCoy train>>>
  
  I think you mean the Colt McCoy rickshaw.
  - ClevelandFrowns
    
    Dumpster fire on wheels.
    - Leftyjsf
      
      Agree and appreciate both responses. I’m hoping for the best with Weeden but fearing that Shurmur will ruin him if he doesn’t perform early in order to try to save a job which should not be his regardless next season
      - bupalos
        
        I’d count on the fact that Shurmur is too lazy to ruin Weeden.
        
        Also I think Weeden comes pre-ruined anyway. He’s going to have to work pretty hard to change the type of pitch and catch he played in OK.
    - wiseoldredbeard
      
      Wheels? It can’t afford wheels. It is just rolling…
  - http://www.autismspeaks.org/ PML
    
    Are you implying a rickshaw is bad? Racist.
    - actovegin1armstrong
      
      Work it Coolie, get me there on time.
    - bupalos
      
      It’s OK because I’m only racist agains Asians.
      - http://www.autismspeaks.org/ PML
        
        Whew.
  - actovegin1armstrong
    
    Bravo again Bupa,
    A rickshaw with a one-legged, drunken coolie.
    
    That is one of my common lines when someone says “I lost my train of thought”.
    I say, “Perhaps it was just a rickshaw”.
    Brilliant minds think alike, and oddly enough brilliant minds and addled minds do as well.
https://twitter.com/jimkanicki jimkanicki

you asked before about the haslam/pilot/flying-j “values.” i think i can help because i suspect theyre much like my company. the flag for me is ‘likes to hire varsity athletes.’ my company was built up through an aggressive sales force whose heritage is college varsity athlete (primarily white male). they targeted not the people actually using the technology but those running the businesses (primarily white male). the formula was hugely successful and my company’s stock had the highest appreciation of any stock in the 90s.* i’m just getting the white male part out of the because it’s a fact;; but it’s not the point i wish to make w.r.t. haslam.

my company’s culture also gives sales guys two quarters to hit their number, rigorous ‘drill-down’ sessions, and bi-annual 10% reductions-in-force simply to keep folks on their toes.

all this is prelude to: i really doubt haslam would hire shurmur to run one of his truck stops; so honcho-ing a billion dollar investment of his.. well.. just dont see it. absent a remarkable –STUNNING– turnaround, i dont think haslam will sit by quietly watching how shurmur does his business.

shurmur needs to step his game up. i know i was hard on him after the first pre-season game.. but it’s not his first game. glad to see he’ll play the starters a full half in green bay. that’s a step in the right direction.

*we beat Dell in the last qtr of 99. it’s EMC.
- bupalos
  
  I have to agree, and I think the sooner the better, because it’s hard to see it not happening. Whatever virtues Shurmur had came as direct extension from Mike Holmgren, and chief among those were authority, stability, and respect (notwithstanding critiques from this corner of the web). Assuming Aslan is taking out million dollar Mike, it’s hard to beilieve Shurmur would survive here. Which pretty much would seem to mean we’re hitting the reset button again, no?
  - NeedsFoodBadly
    
    I think the reset button is very likely. Gonna start all over again in 2013.
  - technivore
    
    I don’t think that’s necessarily true about the “reset button” thing, insofar as it’s not like Shurmur is putting his own unique, indelible stamp on this team. Most folks agree that the most salient thing about Shurmur is just how predictable and by-the-book his offensive gameplanning is. He’s the very definition of a replaceable coach and as long as Heckert sticks around, the identity of the team can only change for the better with a new coach.
    - bupalos
      
      I don’t know. The question would be whether the new owner thought continuity within the west coast system was more important, or getting a strong hardworking leader type. There are a lot of unknowns here that I think definitely open the door to “blow it up.”
      - dubbythe1
        
        either way, we would be so lucky that we dont have a primarily WC qb in Weeden, and maybe a new HC could gameplan toward his strengths…
      - BIKI024
        
        if Banner is pres, I find it hard to believe he is going to veer from the WCO/4-3, but who knows, I guess stranger things haven happened.
    - ClevelandFrowns
      
      The very definition of a replaceable coach.
    - BIKI024
      
      hard to have an “identity of the team’ when you’re lacking impact players as we clearly were last season. Peyton Hillis was a shell of himself and the only guy on offense that was going to help develop any identity to the offense. on defense we started to see some identity being built by some of the playmakers we’re in the process of developing (Taylor, Sheard, Rubin, Haden, Ward, etc).
      
      hopefully having a healthy Trent Richardson on offense as well as some consistent play from the QB and receivers should start the offense trending in a positive direction and building the identity of a power running west coast offense that Shurmur, Childress and Holmgren have plenty of experience executing, when the talent was there, and it appears that we have the talent required: above average offensive line, playmaking, tackle-breaking RBs, and consistency from QB and the WRs. Feel pretty good about the first 2, we’ll see if Weeden and the receivers pull their weight. I’m obviously optimistic that they will make things interesting this year and will be a much more entertaining product.
  - https://twitter.com/jimkanicki jimkanicki
    
    if you take a loosey-goosey unit count of 500 against the estimated 18B total, then revenue contribution per truck stop is 36MM each.
    
    and is 247MM browns total revenue or income? does that include the TV? in any event, haslam did say in the presser that the browns were the family’s second largest investment.
    
    at any rate.. we’re on the same page: this is a key asset for haslam and shurmur must demonstrate ‘operational command’ of his unit at the very least. or he’s gone.
    - humboldt
      
      Do you think Haslem would’ve fired Belichek after his first two seasons in Cleveland? Not a loaded question, genuinely curious in your response.
      - Mburgermeister
        
        imo, no.
        might have promoted him for having courage to draw the line on insubordinate player whose skills -had- diminished in spite of fan popularity.
        
        i expect haslam to be results focused. BB is still fairly heartless in his roster moves.
    - bupalos
      
      I believe 247 is total revenue, it’s the Forbes number, but I am surprised that a business with that listed revenue could possibly sell at 1BB, so maybe I’m missing something.
  - CleveLandThatILove
    
    Kind of like a really expensive hobby, right? My question for all of you football geeks (and I mean that word in the best possible way) is who would be on Banner’s short list of available game changing head coaches?
    - BIKI024
      
      Marty Morningwheg
      - https://twitter.com/jimkanicki jimkanicki
        
        i’d bet you’ll see an end to the bob lamonte connection post-haste too. so.. no marty m.
      - BIKI024
        
        Banner and LaMonte are very familiar with each other since LaMonte represents most of the staff in Philly, including Andy Reid and Banner’s right hand man whilst in Philly, GM Howie Roseman.
    - https://twitter.com/jimkanicki jimkanicki
      
      i dont know about banner, but with haslam living in knoxville, then willie taggart of WKU should be known to him. would be a bold and superlative move.
      
      i want so much to be done with the homgrum/reid ‘tree’… taggart would move us to the harbaugh tree. much better.
      - CleveLandThatILove
        
        Oh definitely Jimmy is running this show. But since he’s relatively new in the NFL biz, I assume that Banner would have all the connections and hopefully a promising list of who’s who in the coaching pond (as opposed to the list of who’s that, thanks a lot Holmgren.)
      - maxfnmloans
        
        won’t hire Kiffin? As far as I am concerned, the fewer of Al Davis’ footsteps Haslaam follows, the better
    - NeedsFoodBadly
      
      The coach that’s going to make PML’s head explode. You know who I mean.
      - http://www.autismspeaks.org/ PML
        
        In light of how it’s been around here lately, I would welcome him back with open arms .
      - actovegin1armstrong
        
        Further proof that PML is not a coward.
        Did I spell that word correctly?
      - http://www.autismspeaks.org/ PML
        
        Yessir
    - bupalos
      
      To put it in a revenue-ratio context, when the wifey started photography she had a day job that made about 40G and did weddings on some weekends that made about $500, with the camera stuff she needed probably about $2500. The Browns purchase for Haslam seems about commensurate to me.
    - dubbythe1
      
      Cowher
- actovegin1armstrong
  
  jk,
  I have sold a lot of cages with an EMC box and now racks.
  I love your company and your local sales guy always answers or calls me back almost instantly.
  All hail the King of storage!
  Dell has nothing on EMC.
Bryan

Its hard to know what to take out of Weeden’s performance. Very small sample size. I thought the Benjamin throw was key because its the kind of throw McCoy can’t make – Weeden had pressure in his face and just sort of flipped that one out there with ease. That is why he offers promise. Whether he figures the rest of the stuff out, who knows?

What did scare me – the Massaqoi concussion, the penalties and general lack of confusion, the lack of depth on Defense, and the many smaller dings (Cameron, Patterson, Paxson, etc.) All of those things are legitimate causes for concern. On a team that is already the consensus worst team in the league, pre-season injuries and poor coaching are very bad signs.

Finally, if any one in this Comment sections is actually still a McCoy fan, please realize the dude put up his numbers against the Lions 2′s and 3′s. And he did so by basically improvising with his feet. We have seen that that style will not work in real NFL games against real NFL defenses. I like the guy, but he ain’t the answer.
- dubbythe1
  
  1. Injuries…. dubbya tee eff??!?
  2. Size of our D (depth and physical)
  3. O-line (expect this to improve, but really?!?)
- rodofdisaster
  
  Bryan..I purposely am not getting into the Weeden vs. McCoy debate. I think the people who defend McCoy aren’t defending him based on his stats because those were certainly awful last year. They’re defending him because we are comparing apples to oranges, making assumptions and then handing the keys to a rookie who’s never taken a real NFL snap.
  
  To be fair, McCoy had more of a shot than some others have gotten and I honestly believe that Weeden has the NFL arm and size to probably beat him out but please call it what it is. We hung the blame for last year on McCoy and we’re replacing him with a guy who seems to pass the eyeball test. It is what it is but a “competition” it was not.
  
  I don’t begrudge anyone the desire to ask the question “what if” for Colt. I just don’t think that’s going to happen for the Browns.
dubbythe1

What drove me nuts was the statement from Shurmur (paraphrased) ‘I saw a lot of things out there’ , my question is how did he when his nose was buried in a playsheet, and more oft he was in wierd positions to see anything. This guy should not be a head coach.
- BIKI024
  
  how many seconds out of the entire game was focused on Shurmur? were you at the game? did you monitor how often “his nose was buried in a playsheet” just curious
- Petefranklin
  
  Ease up on our fearful leader.
ClevelandFrowns

“’I’m hearing that no one in the Cleveland front office or coaching staff should feel secure beyond December,’ King writes in an amazingly comprehensive look at the last seven days in the NFL.”

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/08/13/shakeup-in-cleveland-could-be-coming-after-2012-season/

I mean, I’m hearing the same thing, every day, in every conversation I have with anyone about the Browns, but still.
Bandit

Did any check the stats on RG3 or A. Luck in there first preseason games. I suspect with the genius of Holmgren and Shurmer tutoring Weeden we should have expected just as much. What a laugh. Can’t wait till Shurmer has to interview for a real job. Be luckly to get position coach at St. Ed’s.
- BIKI024
  
  judging QBs by preseason stats, let alone the 1st game makes zero sense nor does it have any bearing on how the guy will perform in the regular season. sure it’s nice to see, and congrats to them for putting up good performances, but you gotta temper your enthusiasm or disappointment in preseason.
  - Emxone
    
    Thanks. But really is there any enthusiasm for Shrumer and the has beens on his coaching staff? Zero sense is even remotely having any faith in this regime.
    - BIKI024
      
      who are you expecting to be on the staff??? players make plays, it seems we have more playmakers this year, especially at key positions such as WR, RB and most of all QB. really don’t get how you can’t be excited to watch their development.
nj0

Pluto: “Obviously, [Jauron] knows something to continually secure good jobs…”

Is Jauron a Lamonte client?
nj0

Not sure if this was covered this weekend – I found it disturbing that that there was so much confusion about MoMass’s concussion status.
- Petefranklin
  
  SSDY same shit different year.
  - nj0
    
    too true. last dozen seasons has been the same madlib.
rgrunds

Can someone explain why we didn’t keep Hillis? I don’t think “strep throat gate” was that bad. He ran well when he wasn’t injured. He just had four runs of 10 yds. each for KC.
- CleveLandThatILove
  
  If he’s healthy in December it will be unbearable to watch what he does to our run defense.
  - rgrunds
    
    Thank you.

Previous post: Browns Pre-season Forecast and The Mystery of the Great Lakes Classic Trophy

Next post: Xs and Os with the Bros: All About (Travis) Benjamin

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